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Worlds Collide: Forcing Variation Into Training

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#1 Stubb

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Posted 06 September 2016 - 07:51 AM



#2 peterthefish

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Posted 06 September 2016 - 08:12 AM

I don't understand how selecting your target based on word problems is more real world than USPSA. Couldn't make it to the end waiting for Pincus to yell out "the ratio of the circumference of a circle to its diameter!"
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#3 Jay870

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Posted 06 September 2016 - 08:26 AM

I don't understand how selecting your target based on word problems is more real world than USPSA. Couldn't make it to the end waiting for Pincus to yell out "the ratio of the circumference of a circle to its diameter!"

 

Because it removes any objective evaluation of skill from drill, therefore tactical.


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#4 Moustache6

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Posted 06 September 2016 - 08:48 AM

Anything related to Pincus is worthless, don't even need to waste time watching the video to know it's a pointless half-baked tacti-tard drill



#5 Buck Turgidson

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Posted 06 September 2016 - 08:52 AM

Couldn't make it to the end waiting for Pincus to yell out "the ratio of the circumference of a circle to its diameter!"

 

I like pie


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#6 Stelio Kontos

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Posted 06 September 2016 - 08:52 AM

Might as well have written "blue" in red color text, and then put a red colored block in another target. Then after calling out "RED" whatever target Rob chooses to shoot, claim he shot the wrong target Rob and couldn't figure out the "real world" problem. Got you fucker!

When he said "half of eight" my thinking was pick either the upper or lower half of the number 8 and shoot it.
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#7 peterthefish

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Posted 06 September 2016 - 09:26 AM

When he said "half of eight" my thinking was pick either the upper or lower half of the number 8 and shoot it.


And that's why you'd fail in real world shooting scenarios where the bad guys shout "A train leaves New York heading Weat towards Chicago at 45 mph...!!!"
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#8 George

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Posted 06 September 2016 - 04:22 PM

This looks like outstanding training to get ready for bad guys wearing numbered jersey, and your pointman telling you which guy to shoot.  Not unrealistic like that competition crap that will get you killed on da street.


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George


#9 mx5

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Posted 06 September 2016 - 05:16 PM

You guys missed the point.


"...wheeling out to my vehicle (in a wheel chair) with a walker across my lap."


#10 MilkMyDuds

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Posted 06 September 2016 - 05:47 PM

Wouldn't surprise targets (like drop-turners, max traps etc.) mixed with NS be better for training like this?



#11 busdriver

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Posted 06 September 2016 - 06:24 PM

There is something interesting about this.  Not as a drill to actually practice mind you.  Rather, the way people think depends on the expediency of the situation.  Given "enough" time (how much is needed depends on your experience) we think through a problem and come up with multiple courses of action and pick the one we like the best.  Without that time, people tend to flash through their "Rolodex" of past solved problems until they find the closest matching situation and go with that solution.  When the Rolodex spins and comes up with "WTF?" you get the duuuuuu, deer in the head lights moment.



#12 Stelio Kontos

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Posted 06 September 2016 - 06:31 PM

Yeah I'm sure there have been many GMs whose minds have been blown by Pincus' figure eight drill.
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#13 Stelio Kontos

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Posted 06 September 2016 - 06:32 PM

You guys missed the point.

Which is?
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#14 peterthefish

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Posted 06 September 2016 - 06:35 PM

You guys missed the point.


I disagree. I get the point - having to problem solve can get you out of your comfort zone. Having said that, stupid target math problems are dumb. Mastering the Pincus Stinkus Drill won't make you a better shooter, and may leave you with training scars as you expect the PA speakers in the food court to start throwing out vague word problems to help you figure out what baddie to engage.

There is something interesting about this. Not as a drill to actually practice mind you. Rather, the way people think depends on the expediency of the situation. Given "enough" time (how much is needed depends on your experience) we think through a problem and come up with multiple courses of action and pick the one we like the best. Without that time, people tend to flash through their "Rolodex" of past solved problems until they find the closest matching situation and go with that solution. When the Rolodex spins and comes up with "WTF?" you get the duuuuuu, deer in the head lights moment.


You're missing some OODA loop derp.

#15 George

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Posted 06 September 2016 - 06:57 PM

Situation: USPSA field courses teach you to shoot arrays of 4 targets, 2 shots on each, reload, etc.

Problem: USPSA field courses are not really like shooting badguys

Implication: You gonna get killed in da streettz if all you practice for, and all you can shoot, are USPSA arrays.

Need:You need some new kind of drills to be ready for da streettz.

 

Classic SPIN consultative sales strategy.

 

I don't necessarily disagree with the SPIN.  However, the solution presented does not really present a great alternative.  I also don't buy the premise that practicing fur USPSA = practicing field courses.  I focus more on individual skills in practice.


George


#16 TrannyOakley

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Posted 06 September 2016 - 07:22 PM

Looks like a fun drill. I could see expanding it more demanding by adding a memory component by having the shooter study a diagram and remember which target represents which symbols. Then you could really get crazy by making a KIMS game out of it, etc... Lots of ways to push this one.



#17 busdriver

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Posted 06 September 2016 - 07:54 PM

You're missing some OODA loop derp.

The level of dumb that goes on when people try to understand Boyd's theories from a couple diagrams is amusing.



#18 CH3NO2

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Posted 06 September 2016 - 09:34 PM

Yep worlds collided and some kinda blackhole opened up...

Really... leatham and pinkass in same video ?...gezzzz I lost all respect for leatham
NITRO
Nitromethane, nitrous oxide, nitrocellulose ....3 of my favorite things
To be sure of hitting the target , shoot 1st and call what ever u hit the target.

#19 phil datpus

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Posted 06 September 2016 - 11:37 PM

Pincus, bless his heart.

Call me a moron but I'd take TGO with me to the food court over any timmies I know (except maybe Gabe who is a Timmie and a gamer, not because he's more ninja, but because he dresses a little more baller than TGO and the post incident photo ops are sure to be off the hook).
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#20 Sad Sack

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Posted 07 September 2016 - 06:30 AM

...except maybe Gabe...

 

He would make an excellent food court companion, as there are plates galore in such a setting. 






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