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Draw speed with different types of holsters.


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#1 Sprewell

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Posted 21 February 2017 - 08:58 AM

I'm trying to get an idea of how much difference the holster configuration and placement on the belt makes to draw speed.

More specifically drawing from surrender position in Steel Challenge.

 

1. Production

2. Single Stack

3. Limited (with open type holster)



#2 SlivGod

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Posted 21 February 2017 - 09:06 AM

I don't think there's a measurable difference between 1 & 2. #3 seems to have the potential to reduce draw times by .1.  In practice, I don't think the average user is actually shaving that off. 


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#3 Buck Turgidson

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Posted 21 February 2017 - 09:28 AM

Can you rank them by how likely each one is to dump your gat on the ground?


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#4 Lloyd Christmas

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Posted 21 February 2017 - 09:36 AM

I can weigh in on this. I started in Prod with a BOSS rig right when they came out about 3 years ago. Switched to Limited and used a Safariland 014 (I think that's the number) open/Limited holster for a year or two. Switched to Single Stack for 9 months with a BOSS rig set up to SS legal height. I found that I liked that setup so much that I have since moved back to Limited and use a BOSS rig set up to SS legal height. I had already made GM when I switched from the Safariland rig to the BOSS for Limited, and there was no difference in speed for me, only comfort level, I just prefer kydex. The speed of your first shot on the draw has very little to do with how much you have to lift the gun out of the holster, and much more to do with getting your hand to the gun quickly, and breaking the shot immediately once it's on target. In other words, use what you like, it doesn't matter.


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#5 snark

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Posted 21 February 2017 - 10:05 AM

If you have long arms and a short torso, then the SS high-ride is a bit slower to get to.

 

Hands at sides is where the scoop action is for race holsters.


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#6 Motosapiens

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Posted 21 February 2017 - 12:58 PM

I personally draw more accurately and at *least* the same speed from belt ride height, especially from a surrender draw. That may be because I usually shoot SS so that's what I'm used to, or it may be because the gun starts closer to where it needs to get to, so both hands and gun don't have to move as far from surrender. So I set my limited rig up to mimic my SS positioning, and that's what I shoot for steel challenge as well.

 

but i have a long-ish torso.


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#7 waktasz

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Posted 21 February 2017 - 01:06 PM

The race holster is more likely to bind and fuck you up than the kydex is likely to be half a hundredth slower.

 

 

And Single Stack is dumb.


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#8 Vega5

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Posted 21 February 2017 - 01:25 PM

I've shot about half of my competitive life with a CR Speed and now with a BOSS. I find I can be much more aggressive with the BOSS at the production position and get the gun out. With a CR Speed I've almost had the gun dump on the ground a couple of times.


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#9 racetaco

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Posted 21 February 2017 - 01:41 PM

I found having all my setups for different divisions the same is the most important. I don't think there is a overwhelming advantage to any position because of surrender position draw. Having a holster you can aggressively draw without worrying about Dairy Queen is nice.
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#10 Sprewell

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Posted 21 February 2017 - 02:27 PM

If you apply the maths to steel challenge peak times, a limited holster rig should be worth .13 seconds per draw for a GM level shooter.

 

4 seconds divided by 31 draws.



#11 TCB

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Posted 21 February 2017 - 02:30 PM

I use a ghost in limited and I know that I am no faster with it than I am with my production boss/bladetech combo.  I honestly wouldn't mind trying kydex for my limited gun, just haven't got around to it yet.



#12 Lloyd Christmas

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Posted 21 February 2017 - 08:15 PM

What I found mostly is that the kydex holster creates a more consistent draw, so for me it's worth it. It kind of guides the gun out of the holster, releasing it forward at the same spot every time, instead of the race holster that just lets go immediately. I find it easier to get my left hand on the gun in the same place more often. Maybe if I tried both holsters back to back and kept trying to just get the absolute fastest time, probably the race holster would win, but that would be a stupid way to pick a holster. I found, like Moto said, that the SS legal height setup was the most consistent for me, so I stuck with that as well. It is noticeably more consistent from surrender or "hands touching Xs" type of starts too. I do have a relatively long torso and short arms though, so that may be a factor. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

#13 Will

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Posted 21 February 2017 - 08:20 PM

The race holster is more likely to bind and fuck you up than the kydex is likely to be half a hundredth slower.
 
 
And Single Stack is dumb.


Confirmed, I had that double alpha shit and it kept binding when I was in Ben's class. Needless to say it's been retired.

#14 Lloyd Christmas

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Posted 21 February 2017 - 08:22 PM

Confirmed, I had that double alpha shit and it kept binding when I was in Ben's class. Needless to say it's been retired.

A bunch of guys that Moto and I shoot with use the Ernie Hill Guga Ribas holsters and they are terrible. I've seen then bind up, not want to lock, and straight up break multiple times to lots of people.

For me it's DAA belt, DAA plastic pouches because the aluminum ones seem to wear out the ball bearing adjuster thing and get loose with time, and a BOSS rig with a Bladetech shell. Simple, and super rugged.

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#15 busdriver

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Posted 21 February 2017 - 08:57 PM

I've got a DAA super duper high speed race blaster perch.  But drawing an open division short sword from a kydex holster seems like it would be a bit Joker-esque, not to mention the thumb rest and racker.  I doubt you could slam your hand down on the gun hard while drawing and expect it not to break eventually.

 

I don't practice/dry fire other than the open gun, if the difference is ~.1x for me in dry fire, I'm sure it's negligible if you actually practice.



#16 TCB

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Posted 22 February 2017 - 08:48 AM

What I found mostly is that the kydex holster creates a more consistent draw, so for me it's worth it. It kind of guides the gun out of the holster, releasing it forward at the same spot every time, instead of the race holster that just lets go immediately. I find it easier to get my left hand on the gun in the same place more often. Maybe if I tried both holsters back to back and kept trying to just get the absolute fastest time, probably the race holster would win, but that would be a stupid way to pick a holster. I found, like Moto said, that the SS legal height setup was the most consistent for me, so I stuck with that as well. It is noticeably more consistent from surrender or "hands touching Xs" type of starts too. I do have a relatively long torso and short arms though, so that may be a factor. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

I think this is the case for me as well, comparing LTD to Prod... but I'm the retard that bought a 5.4" limited gun so finding kydex has been problematic.



#17 jrb06

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Posted 22 February 2017 - 06:29 PM

But what if you use holster lube?
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#18 racetaco

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Posted 22 February 2017 - 06:36 PM

Sperm or tears,,,, depends how the day is going.
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#19 Cranky Gunsmith

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Posted 24 February 2017 - 11:14 AM

Confirmed, I had that double alpha shit and it kept binding when I was in Ben's class. Needless to say it's been retired.

I clean my insert with Armor All periodically. This keeps it from binding, but I've been considering moving back to Kydex.

#20 GooldMember

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Posted 17 April 2017 - 08:40 AM

I used a race holster when I was shooting limited and now in open, so I only use kydex when I am shooting SS. I feel that I can be just as aggressive as getting to the gun with the race holster, and my draw is definetely faster.

Do I think that's because of the holster though? Nope, not one bit. I thinking because I dryfire 45 minutes a day with a race holster and only dig out the SS gun a few times a year.

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